Yes, this Judge, after being thrown under the privy bench over 120 years ago, was recently rescued from a well hidden, shallow pit in Northern Ca. If it wasn't for the efforts of my partners and myself launching an intense 'probathon', the Newmark Gruenberg Judge would've remained silenced for another generation. He's now granted himself probation and resides under house arrest on my whiskey shelf, in between his predecessor Kane-O'Leary, and his much younger successor, S.B. Rothenberg !
After the gavel was passed to them from Kane-O'Leary in late 1882, 
Newmark Gruenberg served up Old Judge Bourbon from the bench only from 1883-1885, , . In 1886 Gruenberg bought out Newmark and had his own bottles made for a year or two.
Newmark Gruenberg served up Old Judge Bourbon from the bench only from 1883-1885, , . In 1886 Gruenberg bought out Newmark and had his own bottles made for a year or two.This dig was exciting, as it was filled with anticipation after waiting many years to explore this site. A recent change in ownership prompted a renewed effort that resulted in successfully obtaining permission to hunt for old bourbons and other Western preparations. A very sparse older pit yielded a broken var 1 JF Cutter in light olive-amber and a few very early S.F. Jamaica Gingers, which coincidentally seem to often hang out with Western liquor containers.
Out of the many bottles and relics recovered from numerous pits, the Old Judge was the lone intact fifth, and probably only survived because it was on the front side of an already sparse pit.
Hopefully, this will be the start of a run of intact Western fifths !
Cool write up, I love layer shots.
ReplyDeleteLewis, doing any digging ? Got any stories ?
ReplyDeleteHow many Newmark Gruenberg variants have you counted AP ?
ReplyDeleteNice job, AP. Them "Northern CA" privies do kick out a few worthwhile pieces of glass on occasion, don't they?
ReplyDeleteWay back in the early '70s, I pulled one of those N.G.s out of the old Sactown dump on 10th St. Ken and I snagged the early "Fat Boy" N.G. punker from a pit in the Point, along with a Frank Gobeys, a Shea Boqueraz, close to a hundred Pioneer sodas and way more than hundred Duffy's. All the Duffers got "Lincoln Logged" back, 'cept the cool globby ones. I'd like to do that one again. I think that HP is about cleaned out, or close to it. That 'ol 'hood ain't the friendliest place I ever dug, but not the worst. LOL
There were many holes missed in HP, but it seems the primitive diggers of the 70s knew the difference between 70s and 90s architecture. Consequently, most of the Non-Abd pits we hit out there are 90s !!!
ReplyDeletePrimitive diggers?! HAH! I don't think so. Back then, we'd give '90s pits a pass and sometimes still do. Us old farts were bringin' up QUALI-TEE while you pups were in diapers. You are makin' a very wrong assumption there, kid. LOL
ReplyDeleteAndrew,
ReplyDeleteThere's the Patent date base, the plain base, and the extremely rare square slug-plate (probably used for their other less popular brands).
Then it changes to M. Gruenberg,repeating with a close look-a-like of the Newmark Gruenberg Old Judge adding "KY" and changing the "S.F." to "San Francisco", and again another square slug-plate. Looks like Gruenberg was the force behind the design patterns on the entire series of bottles...
AP
Us primitive diggers sure did rack up a number of great 5ths in them days!
ReplyDeletewww.oldwestbottles.com
When I started in ABD-ville, we were happy to hit anything undug; TC, 90's, anything 'cept screw-top was good. We did stumble into some virgie 70s holes too on occasion that were undug ! I love it when a TC or 90s hole gives up an nice early "throw-back" like a Leg, globby 1/5, or Cathedral pickle. My 3 McKennas came out of a TC "Turn-Burn" !!
ReplyDeleteWell said AP and congratulations on your recent Judge find. I'll never forget the time you & I were digging a turn burn junker clunker hole and you pulled out a nice 60s black glass ladies leg, I became a believer. There were so many opportunities to dig prime areas in the 1970s that often diggers wouldn't finish a hole if it was deep or sparse. Believe it or not some of the best bottles I've dug came from ABDs that weren't finished. You should of kept going on that McKenna hole till ya hit China!
ReplyDeletewww.oldwestbottles.com
I used to pass on '90s and "turn burns", especially "footballs", which I still won't touch. These days, though, even that stuff is over a century old and warrants a look. I have dug some great "throw backs" from late pits, too, but more often they just have the same marginal glass. TC pits are good for pharmacies, especially local ones that sell quite well. We pulled 5 amber Buffalo Bourbons from one big
ReplyDelete"Turner" in Alkali. That pit was a doozy.
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ReplyDeleteYou guys about done trying to thump on the younger diggers?
ReplyDeleteChrist, it sounds like your the only ones that ever hefted a shovel.
rs
It's all in good opinionated fun, goes both ways but the deceitful stuff does make us all look bad as a group. It ain't easy no matter if your old or young and that's a fact. Some of us old timers are a cranky old kick the dog kind of bunch with this wet weather, now where's my pooch!
ReplyDeletewww.oldwestbottles.com
Personally, I've gotta give any new guy that puts a dig together in heavily dug Northern Ca alot of credit. I remember how ABD it was when I started in the mid '70s. The past 10 yrs I've often commented that I couldn't even fathom guys who started doorknocking after the millenium. What a challenge they would have, ABD almost everywhere ! Sure there are undug places, but can you imagine the amount of time filtering through all of the unknown abd places it would take? Very discouraging at best. These new guys get ZERO Gravy.... Anyone who started a dig program in the past 10 yrs has to have a real love of the bottles, dedication, research savvyness, willingness to learn, and an awfuly lot of persistance.
ReplyDeleteDefintely helps to pick up some techniques from older diggers too. I know I did. I think we all have. None of us pioneered all of the techniques needed to be a successful digger. It's been a long evolving process contributed by many diggers, some of who are on this blog and many who are not. The Old Sac diggers that are still around, can attest to that, as they've seen the full evolution from no probes to door-knob probes, to today's "high speed riddler" probes introduced by GP. It's really been a continuous shared learning process, and I'm sure the new guys will have some cool things to add as well. They will be the ones to take digging to new higher tech levels, like cruising with a full library of maps on a laptop, using GPR, etc.... They'll have to be better than us, if they want to dig the good glass that's still out there.... Other less savvy new diggers will have to just wait for demo projects, which are fewer and fewer these days....
AP
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ReplyDeleteBOYS! OH BOYS!!
ReplyDeleteWe are spoiling a terrific and clever post here. Lets not burn up any friendships! This is a very competitive hobby, lets keep it a friendly competition. We need all you diggers, young and old, to keep on plowin'
Hey, what'd I miss Sole Agent? The "Pilgrims" can poke fun at us "Dinosaurs", but any other friendly banter is removed. What's up with that? HAR!
ReplyDeleteO.C. the "fun" and "friendly" are the key words. I may have taken out a comment or two that were fun and friendly, but it was starting to get over the top.
ReplyDeleteGive the young bucks the spotlight for a bit. The real question will always be 15 years of fame or 15 minutes of fame. Or 50 years of "fame"?? in your case... you old fart!
A couple of points I'd like to share with the group:
ReplyDelete1. Thank you A.P. for an awesome write-up on a sweet find!!! Unless I'm on a digging road-trip somewhere in Nor Cal, I'm basically stuck in a "digging prison" of sorts here in So Cal. For us San Diego guys, it's really cool to simply hear about the stuff that's still being dug on a pretty regular basis up there -- unlike it is here.
2. I find it quite ironic that some of us were "judging" each other within a blog post that began with the "Old Judge." So what would the "Old Judge" rule regarding who's right or wrong, ethical or unethical, experienced or inexperienced, worthy or unworthy, INNOCENT OR GUILTY? Not a single one of us is perfect, right? It seems most of these "accusations" may actually be based more on hearsay, speculation, or via the rumor mill, rather than on tangible facts. Before we accuse, classify, or judge someone else (especially in a blog), I'd first suggest seeking to understand by communicating in- person if you have an issue with them, their practices, or their ethics. I’ve heard a fair share of stories (both good and bad) about a number of different folks in the hobby. And if I listened to everything that was “said” I’d have very few friends in the hobby?!?! So instead, I’ve really tried hard to form my own opinion about each person, based on my personal interaction and experience with them – not solely based on someone else’s claim, interaction, or tale.
3. I truly see the members of this blog (and beyond) as a BROTHERHOOD. Sure, brothers often quarrel and sometimes even fight. It's normal for brothers to disagree, make fun of each other, and keep each other in check. But brothers are also supposed to have each other's back on the important stuff -- like the very survival and success of this unique hobby. Certainly some of us fit into the roles of "older brother" or "younger brother," but we need each other equally, as one side ultimately ends up either suffering or thriving based on what the other side thinks, says, and does.
Parting thoughts: This blog is supposed to support and strengthen friendship, encourage discussion, and provide an alternate means of communication between those of us who are passionate about glob top whiskey bottles, right? If I was still a “brand new” collector reading through all of this banter, would I feel encouraged at all about getting more involved with the Western Whiskey scene? It’s time to put the egos aside gents….and maybe the glass too, especially if it means the difference between making friends and creating enemies.
All for now,
~L.C.W.
Very well said JF.
ReplyDeleteCase dismissed and closed !!
Old Judge (AP)